There was just a trace of a smile on Vetinari's lips. 'Not any cook. A genius amongst cooks.'
'Well, I must admit to being surprised,' said her ladyship.
'And upset?' said Vetinari. 'A little jealous, perhaps?'
'Havelock, you go too far!'
'Would you expect otherwise? Besides, you must surely realize that his triumph is yours too?'
'Did I tell you that I've seen some of them?' said Margolotta after a while.
'The orcs?'
'Yes. They really are wretched. Of course, people say that about the goblins and while it is true that they religiously save their own snot, and, frankly, just about everything else, at least there is a logic to it.'
'Well, a religious logic, at least,' murmured Vetinari. 'They tend to be quite stretchable.'
'The Igors made them from men, did you know?'
Vetinari, still holding his glass, walked to the other end of the table and picked up the pepperpot. 'No. However, now you tell me, it's patently obvious. Goblins would not have been nearly ferocious enough.'
'And they had nothing,' said Margolotta. 'No culture, no legends, no history¨Che could give them those.'
'Everything they are not, he is,' said Vetinari, adding, 'but that's an enormous weight you're putting on his shoulders.'
'How much is on mine? How much of a weight is on yours?'
'It's rather like being a carthorse,' said Vetinari. 'After a while one ceases to notice, it's just the way of life.'
'They deserve their chance and it must be taken now, while the world is at peace.'
'Peace?' said Vetinari. 'Ah, yes, defined as a period of time to allow for preparation for the next war.'
'Where did you learn such cynicism, Havelock?'
Vetinari spun around and began his absent-minded walk along the length of the table again. 'Well, mostly from you, madam, though I have to say that the credit is not all yours, since I have had an extended period of further education as tyrant of this city.'
'I think you allow them too much freedom.'
'Oh, yes, I do. That's why I am still tyrant of this city. The way to retain power, I have always thought, is to ensure the absolute unthinkability of oneself not being there. I shall help you in any way I can, of course. There should be no slaves, even slaves to instinct.'
'One person can make a difference,' said Margolotta. 'Look at Mister Shine who is now Diamond King of Trolls. Look at yourself. If men can fall - '
Vetinari gave a sharp laugh. 'Oh, they can, indeed.'
' - then orcs can rise,' said Margolotta. 'If that is not true then the universe is not true.'
There was a velvet-like knock at the double doors and Drumknott entered. 'Mister Nutt is here, sir.' He added with a certain disdain, 'And he's with that... woman, who cooks in the university.'
Vetinari glanced at Margolotta. 'Yes,' he said. 'I think we should see him in the main hall.'
Drumknott coughed. 'I think I should tell you, sir, that Mister Nutt acquired entrance to the building through gates that were securely locked.'
'Did he tear them off their hinges?' asked Vetinari with apparent enthusiastic interest.
'No, sir, he lifted the gates bodily off their hinges and stacked them neatly against the wall.'
'Ah, then there is still hope for the world.'